Island Where Dreams Come True=Hell?

onlymystory

onlymystory

Circus Ringmaster
Knight of the Noble Order
I was just wondering what others thought. I've always gotten the impression that the island where dreams come true is Lewis's interpretation of hell. Someone once told me that God is not so much punishing us by sending us to hell, but giving us the desires of our heart. The people who go to hell are the ones who have said they don't want anything to do with God. And so God answers that dream, he completely separates Himself from them so they never have to have anything to do with Him. But once they're there, people realize that getting their dream is not what they thought. I always saw the island as the same thing. The sailors are thrilled at first, my dreams come true, but then the missing lord says not daydreams, dreams! The sailors realize how some of their dreams could turn on them. To me that would be a horrible sort of hell.
Any thoughts?
 
The best way I have heard the Island Where Dreams Come True explained is that it is a magnifying glass into the heart. An island such as this one would reveal the content of our hearts' desires in that whatever we wished would come true. I think of this island as being the Ring of Gyges.

According to Greek tradition (and Plato's Republic) Gyges was a shepherd who found a ring that enabled him to become invisible (LotR inspiration anyone?). Gyges used the ring to eventually seduce the queen of his land, and kill the king. The story as told in the Republic is Socrates' answer as to why to live a just life.

In our context the Island Where Dreams Come True is the Ring of Gyges because it gives opportunity for absolute power. One might ask why this is so terrible, and why would the Island be such a terrible place, and the reason is this. Absolute power becomes a nightmarrish idea in the hands of those who lack absolute wisdom. Such authority in the hands of a sinful people becomes destructive. Unless I know that my heart is absolutely in the right place at all times, I do not want all my dreams to come true.
 
"Only My Story"-- I love that name. I always appreciated it when Aslan used that phrase to rebuff nosiness.

"The Weight of Glory"--I've heard of the ring of Gyges, but only in Herodotus, where the peasant uses it to kill the king of Persia. If you know where it's cited in Plato, please send me a private message. (So as not to clutter up this thread.) I'd love to find it.

I'd always looked on this island as a fairy tale element ("be careful what you wish for"). You've opened my eyes to a new interpretation, onlymystory. Have you read Lewis's "The Great Divorce?" Your take on the island fits right in with that book.

It's completely unorthodox, yet it seems right. I'll have to sleep on it.
 
The Great Divorce was partially where I took it from. speaking of the island bringing you your hearts desires, that theory follows along with the mirror of erised in Harry Potter which does the same thing. I just always thought of the island as hell. I didn't know that story though, could one of you private message me the citation in plato as well? i'll have to dig out my old books again.
 
oh, thanks for the comment on my name, I chose it because I love that part of Aslan and also because I can't tell you what God thinks or CS Lewis thinks or even what another member thinks. I can only tell my story and hope that's enough.
 
The only flaw in the "Heart's Desire" theory is that, no one would desire the horrors on the island.

You see, that's what everyone thought having their "dreams fulfilled" meant. You go, and get endless riches and money and fame. But it isn't so. Not your waking dreams and desires but rather your dreams.

If anything, I think it's a condemnation of the way some people can use their imagination or the cynical view of the world so many people have. That's what's truly unconsciously in their hearts, and those are the beasts that populate that island.

As they were fleeing they were fearing these monsters and I think I remember someone wondering about something climbing on the ship and what not.

I think CSL was throwing a mirror to people's and societies inherent pessimism. At least that's what I think. Maybe hopelessness? Depression? If anything I think it would more closely parallel the dementors in Harry Potter than the Mirror of Erised. I think.
 
To me Lewis is trying to say that thoughts are immensely powerful and we must be careful with what we think. In our rashness, we often say "I wish that so and so..." when we actually don't mean it and, in extreme circumstances they cannot be reversed. Human thought can be a terrifying thing.
 
I agree, and also that he is trying to tell us to be careful for what we wish for, because maybe someday it may turn on us, hurt us the most. :(
 
my only thought is why didn't their good dreams come true on that island aswell? i don't know about the rest of you, but i don't only have nightmares
 
I have never thought like that when I was reading the book, but that's very probable. I absolutely agree.

lionessofgod said:
I agree, and also that he is trying to tell us to be careful for what we wish for, because maybe someday it may turn on us, hurt us the most. :(
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That's exactly what I think.
 
hmm...I don't know if that island's message is particularly that message, but maybe something a little bit more erm...'stern', like: "what we wish for is not always what we want". Something like that, at least.
 
The insistance on "not DAYdreams but DREAMS" does not strike on what we wish for but what haunts our subconscious mind.

I cannot cite a canon source, but that island, which was barren, was home to non-corporeal beings, creatures of thought alone. Their entire happiness and existence was based around the richness of their imagination.

They created a place where the only thing that was real was thought. Because they were vastly intelligent and so fully self aware that they had no 'subconscious' mind, it became a dangerous place for people who DO have one.
 
If you think about it, Jesus describes hell as being a place of "weeping and gnashing of teeth". What this describes in my opinion is people who came to the full realization of what their life choices have cost them. These people have to bear the reality of their deepest subconcious fears comming to reality.
The Dark Island is very similar to that concept. It is a place without light, and without hope, where the only reality comes from your very subconcious. You realize that which you have hidden deep within your subconcious is your only world and you would lament that world forever.
I feel that there is a strong correlation between the Dark Island and hell.
 
Knight of Narnia said:
If you think about it, Jesus describes hell as being a place of "weeping and gnashing of teeth". What this describes in my opinion is people who came to the full realization of what their life choices have cost them. These people have to bear the reality of their deepest subconcious fears comming to reality.
The Dark Island is very similar to that concept. It is a place without light, and without hope, where the only reality comes from your very subconcious. You realize that which you have hidden deep within your subconcious is your only world and you would lament that world forever.
I feel that there is a strong correlation between the Dark Island and hell.
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Very nicely said. I agree.
 
Couple of things (actually three):

1) A number of the things in VDT are vaguely reminiscent of the kind of things people believed there were living in remote corners of the world, back in mediæval times. Last year I read Baudolino, a big thick book by Umberto Eco which includes a search for Prester John (a Christian king believed to live in the lands beyond the pagan kingdoms), and the creatures the travellers allegedly found on their way would have slotted straight into VDT, including Monopods for a start.

2) Terrifying dreams are the theme of Hamlet's "To be or not to be" speech, as he is arguing with himself that life is such a crock anyone might as well end it, were it not for the fear of the dreams in Death's sleep from which there is no waking. And while it would be nice to have good dreams come true, one bad dream coming true might be enough to more than balance the scales in the wrong direction.

3) There's an interesting parallel with that very good SF film The Forbidden Planet, where an ancient civilization (the Krell) built themselves an enormous machine powered by an unimaginably huge fusion reactor. It could create material objects out of thin air, and they put it under telepathic control (all Krell being telepathic). But though the Krell were good bordering on the angelic, they still had the ancient emotions of fear, hatred and jealousy deep in their subconscious, and when they slept and their conscious minds weren't restraining their subconscious, the machine obediently put flesh on all those emotions... and the entire planet's population was exterminated overnight.

My vote goes to "not hell, just one of those weird places at the edge of the world".
 
the island where dreams come true? it shows the harmful nature of uncontrolled desires and fears: moral we should have no fear and we should control our passions- of course this is our (the souls) job
 
Actually I think there is no real deep meaning behind the Island Where Dreams Come True.

The idea is inherently horrifying, like Scylla from Greek Mythology, the creature with many heads that grows back two when you lop one off. It added spice and mystery to the voyage. Lots of ancient tales of long voyages were full of encounters with mysterious things that threatened the travellers. This was an imaginative idea from a great storyteller.

As for the point he was making, I think Lewis was exploring two things here, the first being the King's successful application of mercy over curiosity (ordering people not to ask him for details) and the second being the rest of a hideously tormented soul when he touched the stone knife. I believe those two things were the actual "points" Lewis was making, not the nature of the island but the nature of what it did to the sailor.
 
You're confused over one small detail. The three lords already asleep on Ramandu's island were asleep because one of them dared to touch the stone knife, but Lord Rhoop was put to sleep there by Ramandu himself.
 
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