Mistakes in the movie - are we going too far?

Fantasma

New member
I have heard many 'mistakes' that happened especially in the Prince Caspian movie, and I'm wondering what you all think about it. Not to offend anyone - not at all! - but aren't we going just a little too far in complaining about every tiny detail that the director forgot in the movie? For example, the thing about Lucy sitting on the Stone Table. And the knife used to cut Caspian's hand, it looking like the same one used on Aslan in the first movie.
 
I have heard many 'mistakes' that happened especially in the Prince Caspian movie, and I'm wondering what you all think about it. Not to offend anyone - not at all! - but aren't we going just a little too far in complaining about every tiny detail that the director forgot in the movie? For example, the thing about Lucy sitting on the Stone Table. And the knife used to cut Caspian's hand, it looking like the same one used on Aslan in the first movie.

I agree. I mean, every good movie needs at least a little critisizm(sp?), but pointing out every single little detail isn't exactly necessary. Not to offend anyone!
 
I have heard many 'mistakes' that happened especially in the Prince Caspian movie, and I'm wondering what you all think about it. Not to offend anyone - not at all! - but aren't we going just a little too far in complaining about every tiny detail that the director forgot in the movie? For example, the thing about Lucy sitting on the Stone Table. And the knife used to cut Caspian's hand, it looking like the same one used on Aslan in the first movie.

*I started the thing about Lucy sitting on the STone TAble merely to get other people's opinions on it; it was NOT complaining on my part for your information. :) *

But I agree; the level that this kind of complaining has gone to is ridiculous. I mean, folks, the film has been made, it's out on dvd, so get over it. There's nothing we can do to change what's already been done.

And I don't like people being so pessimistic about Dawn Treader. It's a brand new team for pete's sake! Give them a chance!
 
I thought Prince Caspian was a wonderful movie, and the mistakes were far too small for me to even notice. :rolleyes: That's just my opinion.
 
I thought Prince Caspian was a wonderful movie, and the mistakes were far too small for me to even notice. :rolleyes: That's just my opinion.

What :eek:!? Um sorry people but I'm not complaing about every little detail, Like Lucy on the Stone Table and the Knife, I'm thinking more along lines of uh The Castle Raid, Aslan being in it less, events were so out of order... like that. I don't care if they used a knife to cut Caspian's hand that was like the one used on Aslan or Lucy on The Stone Table, at least not as much as the whole picture.

Whats really sad too is that the movie makers didn't even do the movie for the reason Lewis wrote the books. But thats a bit off topic so...

Littler mistakes I can handle... like in the First movie they reversed some of the character's actions from what they were in the book. The Castle scene in PC I resent with all knowledge.

And Lila, have you read the Narnia books? It makes me wonder after hearing you say you can hardly notice the mistakes in the 2nd Narnia movie.

I think of the 2nd Narnia movie as its own, meaning it is separate from the books. Thats how differnt it is from the book, to me at least.
 
Mozart the Meerkitten, yes I have read the books. I've loved them since I was a child and I would never mean to criticize them with any malicious intent. But I don't consider it a "mistake" when a movie does not follow a book EXACTLY. Yes, Prince Caspian had some major differences from the book, but think about it - if the film followed every detail in the book EXACTLY, then it would be a pretty boring movie. I'm not saying that Prince Caspian is bad as a novel, I'm saying that it's more suited for words on a page than for actions on a screen. I think that the way the interpreted the story for the screen was excellent, and that's my opinion.
 
Mozart the Meerkitten, yes I have read the books. I've loved them since I was a child and I would never mean to criticize them with any malicious intent. But I don't consider it a "mistake" when a movie does not follow a book EXACTLY. Yes, Prince Caspian had some major differences from the book, but think about it - if the film followed every detail in the book EXACTLY, then it would be a pretty boring movie. I'm not saying that Prince Caspian is bad as a novel, I'm saying that it's more suited for words on a page than for actions on a screen. I think that the way the interpreted the story for the screen was excellent, and that's my opinion.

Exactly? They barely followed it at all (I think)!!! And I have a 10 year old cousin who agrees with me.

As I said I don't care if they follow every little detail perfectly, I just want it a little closer to the book.
These are my three main issues with the movie:

1. The Raid on the Castle. The thing that saved it was Edmund and the mice.

2. Aslan should have been in it waaay more.

3. Three words: Caspain and Susan. Again Why was that there??


I think that the way the interpreted the story for the screen was excellent, and that's my opinion.

I'd like to let you know that from my experince with whatcing the some bounus features containing comments from moviemakers they didn't really even do the movie from a Christian aspect... At least that is the impression I got from it.

I also don't want to start a detailed argument about veiws on the 2nd Narnia movie PC so I contend to end this disscusion now before it becomes problimatic.

I respect your veiws on the movie Lila but since we have differnt veiws I am going to stop with this topic before I get worked up and consequently get others worked up about it.
 
Hey, I'm not trying to start a fight. I respect your views. :)

I'd like to let you know that from my experince with whatcing the some bounus features containing comments from moviemakers they didn't really even do the movie from a Christian aspect... At least that is the impression I got from it.

Is that necessarily a bad thing?
 
Is that necessarily a bad thing?

Yes in light of Lewis wanted The Narnia books to be Christian... The first movie captured that... The second one did it the wrong way.

One should respect the veiws of the author if one copies their book or anything else. In not making the second Narnia movie Christian (or at least Christian based) they are not respecting Lewis's books or C.S Lewis either. Actually I heard from a reliable Christian place Lewis never even wanted the books made into movies.

Tis what I say. :)
 
As to what the original question was(the thread title), I'm afraid I have to say yes. All those mistakes that people pointed out made me look for mistakes, and now I look at PC and say "that's a terrible movie, and it shouldn't have been made at all". Now, I'm a big Narnia fan, and I can still enjoy the movie, but looking for mistakes and little details just ruins the whole experience of enjoying a movie. Yes, PC is still a good movie, but compared to the book it was a disaster. So, I'm excited about VDT, and I guess you could say it is a "reboot", like Batman Begins and the "Incredible Hulk" movies were.
 
Ok, first off, I agree with Lila here. What the filmmakers did was not necessarily a bad thing, unless you make it so.

Second, Narnia is not a Christian series to everyone who reads them. I'm sorry, but they're not. In fact, Lewis didn't really even intend for them to be so powerfully Christian, but as with most things nowadays, it's all in the eyes of the beholder. What one person might get out of one film is not the same thing someone else might. Or books in this case. Someone, like a very devoted HP fan, may get bent out of shape over any kind of differences that were in the films, while someone who has read the books just doesn't really see fit to make a big deal over it. What someone might see as a bad things, someone else sees it as a good thing.

That's life. It doesn't matter where you go or what you're talking about, people will vary on their opinions about certain things. A Lot of people DON'T see Narnia as being Christian; they see them as being simply good fantasy. Another example is LotR; some may see them as being Christian, but others will simplly see them as being good books that have been turned into a huge film trilogy.

So narnia is Christian only in the eyes of those who perceive it as such. One person might see The White witch as being the representation of Satan, while another person might see her as just a villain who is cruel. I mean good grief, I didn't read LWW for the longest time because of "Witch" in the title. They were recommended to me and so I read them. What I thought was bad was really something that was great. So even in my case, what Narnia is lies in the eyes of the reader. Or mind. Most people, even Christians, will see it as just good fantasy and fiction. you perceive it as Christian because you see the parallels between Biblical truths and the Narnian world. I perceive it as Christian too, but I know that not everyone sees it that way. In fact, Narnia isn't even really listed as Christian fiction. From what I've seen, it's listed along with all the other fiction\fantasy.
 
"I have heard many 'mistakes' that happened especially in the Prince Caspian movie, and I'm wondering what you all think about it. Not to offend anyone - not at all! - but aren't we going just a little too far in complaining about every tiny detail that the director forgot in the movie? For example, the thing about Lucy sitting on the Stone Table. And the knife used to cut Caspian's hand, it looking like the same one used on Aslan in the first movie."

Fantasma, some "mistakes" are simple and complaining about them can be seen as nit picking. However, the bigger mistakes are the ones that affect the story of future stories. Lucy sitting on the Stone Table is more in the former category, with perceived respect of revered artifacts the issue rather than content-based issues. The stone knife is more problematic. In VotDT, only Lucy recognized the stone knife as she was the only one who had seen it. After the White Witch had been defeated, the stone knife had been brought to Ramadu's Island, never to be seen by human eyes until the three Lords arrived.

Bob
 
A Rebuttal

Four words: Here we go again.

For starters, I'm not trying to offend anyone in this post, so bear with me. This is my rebuttal for the main blasts I've heard and read against the movie for its "inaccuracies."

I read the book, "Prince Caspian," and absolutely thought it sucked. I hoped, so very badly that they would not stay true to it because of how terribly the book dragged. They did and I LOVED it, and I'll tell you why.

I've seen many here who've shown their "hot heaping humps of hatred" for "Prince Caspian" the movie, and not one of them has ever, ever said how any of the things they either added, subtracted, or altered were "wrong" in the sense of storytelling. Sure, it didn't follow the book. Isn't storytelling supposed to be about enjoyment? So many people who stick to C.S. Lewis' original writings have shown their utmost disgust for anything un-Narnia related if presented in a Narnia film. Why? Obsession.

Aravis is absolutely right in every way, I can't even describe how right she is. Lewis' Narnia stories were not written in some dim-lit room with research papers and concentrated thought. We're not talking Stephen King or... Tolkien. We're talking children's stories, of which he never indicated he was seriously putting all his thought into, and which I'm positive that if he went back in time, he would write them all over again differently. There goes your "by the book" mantra out the window. It's almost as if the books have become a dogma among fans. It's scary.

--People are upset about the "Peter/Caspian" conflict presented. Why? Because Peter's not a Jesus character like the perfect boy he is in the book? No one is like Peter in reality. So what can the filmmakers do? They give him some character qualities and quirks (trust me, I've read all about screenwriting). Let's examine this character's situation. Peter is a boy who just got back from ruling over thousands. He was the high king, practically ordained by Aslan, who himself (or should I say Himself) is Jesus incarnate, apparently. Ok, personally ordained to be a high king by God? Yeah, I want that. :D Frankly, I'd be a bit pissed if I couldn't return, because of the wonder, magic, enjoyment, kingship, fun, riches, friends, and adventures I left behind. Peter is suddenly wisked back to Narnia. I'd be as happy as anything if I were him.

Narnia is under tyranny, and needs a new king. Been over a thousand years; it's time for some good things to happen. Caspian is young, inexperienced, and a bit naive. After a short while, Caspian has the loyalty of the Narnians. Peter comes in and understands the status quo. Now... what do they do? They raid the castle. I'll talk about that addition in a bit. They lose. Now, I don't know about you, but Peter is a human. Wouldn't it be natural for Peter to take out his anger on something?
"Oh no! No! Peter's a good boy! He does the right thing!"
(How many times have I heard that... :rolleyes:)

We're talking about teenagers here.
"That's not the point! The point is that we follow Peter's example! That was Lewis' intent!"
The most noble and wise people who have ever lived on this planet (besides Jesus) have learned from... their decisions? No... Their triumphs? Nah, can't be... Oh, I know! ...Their mistakes? That's how people relate: they learn from their mistakes. Peter made a mistake and that was the pinch. Everyone can relate to someone as noteworthy as Peter, the High King of Narnia when he learns from a blunder he makes. That's how leaders become wise. If we have a perfect idol who knows no wrong like Dudley Do-Right, we have a flat, unconvincing card that carries as far as clouds carrying stones. A character like that has no substance, no emotion. We might as well call him Aslan 2.

Not that Aslan isn't a wonderful character, but Aslan is excused because he's a god, and plus he lets the Narnians run their own country most of the time (we're talking 100 to 1000 years in jumps). It is then up to the characters to figure out their problems. In every book it is the characters who always fix their emotional, internal problems. Aslan does nothing to interfere with that. He only interferes when the Narnians have no way of accomplishing their goal without his help. Sure, he may visit them and give them advice, but he only gives them help, never the answer... unless he knows it's impossible for them to figure out certain things (like their deaths in TLB).

We are also all forgetting how Peter and Caspian both resolve their differences in the movie later after the white witch is destroyed again.

--Many are upset about the Susan/Caspian or "Suspian" relationship (as some refer). The excuses for it being wrong?
"Plot-wise, it messes with the relationship between Caspian and Ramandu's daughter in VDT!"
No, it doesn't. This attraction between Susan and Caspian is only carried to the extent of flirtation. That is it. The "romance" (which it can hardly be called so) is resolved with Susan's decision to never return. It is also resolved with her line, "I'm 1300 years older than you," and it is also resolved with the 3-year time gap in Narnia in-between the events of "Prince Caspian" and "Voyage of the Dawn Treader"; surely young Caspian has lost his interest in Susan by then.
"It wasn't in the book! And it's unnecessary!"
I thought it was cute. Two people possessing looks like Susan and Caspian would naturally be attracted to one another at first meeting. It's not much of a "bizarre" idea. Considering the time frame of the book would give us an hour-long movie, which is much too short, it adds a bit more beef into the story; nice subtle subplot, carried out and dissolved in the end. There is no indication anywhere of anything remotely close to a "relationship" between the two, and this false idea should immediately cease being discussed because it just isn't true. The form is simply not there.

Sure, it isn't in the book, but it isn't necessarily wrong. It goes against none of Lewis' principles, and I'm positive that if Lewis himself were here he would not object.


---Continued in next post...
 
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---Continued from last post...

--The castle raid was a big question among Narnia fans. Why does it exist in the movie? The only argument against that I'm aware of:
"It wasn't in the book."
True, it was never mentioned, but it was referred to in the mention of the "many battles" that took place outside our knowledge. It's true these battles happened before the arrival of the children but we're making a movie here, and we need some sort of "big event" to tie it together. The only such event that could be entered into the story would be a "battle." The castle raid is another sequence that Lewis would've most likely never objected to. There are many Narnia fans who would agree with me here. Though it isn't chronologically accurate to the book, it still sells as an "okay" addition.

--The argument:
"The Christian elements just weren't there. The filmmakers are biased!"
What Christian elements are "so apparent" in this movie? I am a Christian, and I found NONE. Call me crazy. Here's an absurd review I read on how the "Christian elements" really are presented in the movie:
"This movie was awesome (I went to the first matinee yesterday). The biblical references are clear to Christians. The movie started out with the battle of good v. evil as we find Peter embroiled in battle in a subway, much like Peter in the early church. If I were a priest/minister/preacher, I could preach a didactic sermon series on each scene/segment of the movie. Things moved so quickly that I didn't even care that it was 2 1/2 hours. When and where Asland appears made mindful reference as to what C.S.Lewis' vision of the final battle between good and evil might look like. BTW - Did anyone notice that near the end of the movie, the face that Asland summons in the water, looked very Shroud of Turin/Jesus - ish?"
Now, let's take this very same description and change the names:
"This movie was awesome (I saw the first showing on the Sci-Fi network). The biblical references are clear to Christians. The movie started out with the battle of good v. evil as we find Paul Atreides embroiled in a battle in his mind, suffering the dreams he's been having about his dying father, and wondering who he really is, much like Peter in the early church. If I were a priest/minister/preacher, I could preach a didactic sermon series on each scene/segment of the movie. Things moved so quickly that I didn't even care that it was 6 hours. When and where his father appears made mindful reference as to what Frank Herbert's vision of the final battle between good and evil might look like."
The Dune Chronicles has practically the same plot as Prince Caspian, I cannot count the similarities between the two, there are thousands. We could just as easily construe the story of "Dune" (which is a powerful story as well as a magnificently written novel and miniseries, IMO) to be Christian, though Herbert was a Buddhist, and made no such claim. I'm appalled that people would say the Harry Potter books are anywhere near the vicinity of "Christian." As Rowling put it so well in Time magazine:
"I did not set out to convert anyone to Christianity; I wasn't trying to do what C. S. Lewis did. It is perfectly possible to live a very moral life without a belief in God, and I think it's perfectly possible to live a life peppered with ill-doing and believe in God."
"Christian elements" all lay on the interpreter. The only overtly Christian allegory I ever saw was in "The Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe" with the whole scenerio surrounding Christ's last hours, his sacrifice, and his return. The second was "The Last Battle," where there's a false prophet, an "anti-Christ," a final battle, and the end of the world. Those are the two that actually spell out C-h-r-i-s-t-i-a-n-i-t-y. The others may have references, but they are certainly not allegory.

All I have to add to this is to advise everyone to read Aravis' recent post here again. I couldn't have put it better.

I can't think of any other "terribly wrong" instances in the movie. If I missed any please feel free to post and I'll give my answer. :)

Now someone'll say (sarcastically),
"I guess we should throw all the books out the window, then! Doesn't matter if it goes by the book, doesn't go by the book... Why don't we discard Tolkien's Lord of the Rings series? We don't need it, the movies have been made. We don't need "books." What are "books"?

Oh, and the writer's opinion has no matter at all. The writer's intentions are totally irrelevant to the issue."
Blah blah blah and it'll go on for a couple more paragraphs. :rolleyes: Someone once called me "Mr. Hollywood" (he'll probably be here to stake that claim). I'm not trying to destory the writer. I like the Narnia series. I think the series is written for children; I think Lewis wasn't arduously choosing just the right words to write the perfect novel. The books are books, and the movies are movies. Try to distinguish the two. Movies are meant for enjoyment, not nit-picking. If the movie adds something, or changes something, exactly how does that ruin the story?

I read "The Time Machine." Wonderful story; very thought-provoking. Then I watched George Pal's version, which changed it very much. Then came Simon Wells's version, which was practically a different story. I loved both movies. Why? I enjoyed the storyline presented. Sure, H.G. Wells's book was completely altered in many cases, but that didn't stop me from enjoying the movie! We must put aside the changes and additions put into Prince Caspian and enjoy it for what the movie is. It's fun, it's exciting, it's dramatic; scary; thrilling; amazing. I loved it because it was a good movie. So what if the book was changed? It was still one hell of a movie, and I'm not going to let a few artistic liberties ruin it for me. None of you should either.
"I just wanted them to make a movie according to the book! Why couldn't they just do that??"
Well, they didn't do it exactly. This is what we've got. Live with it. Enjoy it. If you want Lewis' version, read the book. If you want a different (better, IMO) version, watch the movie. If you can't take it, then I'm sorry. I can't help you.
 
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Truman, I didn't read all your post(s) but I agree with you. And you agree with me?! :eek: wow. :p Anyway, I do agree with your posts. You put a lot of thought and time into those.
 
---Continued from last post...

--The castle raid was a big question among Narnia fans. Why does it exist in the movie? The only argument against that I'm aware of:

True, it was never mentioned, but it was referred to in the mention of the "many battles" that took place outside our knowledge. It's true these battles happened before the arrival of the children but we're making a movie here, and we need some sort of "big event" to tie it together. The only such event that could be entered into the story would be a "battle." The castle raid is another sequence that Lewis would've most likely never objected to. There are many Narnia fans who would agree with me here. Though it isn't chronologically accurate to the book, it still sells as an "okay" addition.

I agree about the 'many battles and I believe its were the idea came from.

but as I mentioned earlier Lewis did not want Narnia made into a movie. I heard that from Grown ups.

And I disagree strongly with your comment "The castle raid is another sequence that Lewis would've most likely never objected to." For one thing he is dead so you don't really have right to decide what his opianion would be. 2nd if he had wanted something of that sort in his book he would have put it in!

If you want though I'll add this to my many list of questions to ask people when i get to heaven... then at least we won't start World War 3 :rolleyes:.

Until then I postpone this argument until further reference.
 
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Well, more than likely Douglas Gresham, Lewis' stepson, approved all the changes. I mean, he WAS executive producer. So, I think I'd more or less trust him with changes because he knew the man and deeply respected him. :)
 
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