Ages of Pevensie children?

We also don't know when Peter's exams actually are, do we? He's studying for them in the summer, but I suppose they could be as much as a year away. Maybe he's really responsible.

Lucy's got to be in her second year in SC because PC was her first; VDT is a year after PC and SC is a couple months after that. I guess she could be thirteen in PC, but that seems *awfully* old. If she's twelve in LWW and Ed's thirteen, just--wow. But an elementary school, hm, that could work.

If you talked to your grandmother that would be fantastic! Sooo much easier than poking around online. I guess she would know when people usually started boarding school and when they stopped, and also what sort of exams they might take while they were there. (And tell her thanks from a bunch of people you met online, although you might not want to say that part.)
 
Animus Wyrmis said:
We also don't know when Peter's exams actually are, do we? He's studying for them in the summer, but I suppose they could be as much as a year away. Maybe he's really responsible.

Lucy's got to be in her second year in SC because PC was her first; VDT is a year after PC and SC is a couple months after that. I guess she could be thirteen in PC, but that seems *awfully* old. If she's twelve in LWW and Ed's thirteen, just--wow. But an elementary school, hm, that could work.

If you talked to your grandmother that would be fantastic! Sooo much easier than poking around online. I guess she would know when people usually started boarding school and when they stopped, and also what sort of exams they might take while they were there. (And tell her thanks from a bunch of people you met online, although you might not want to say that part.)
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I think it has to be an elementary because if Lucy's in second year then Jill and Eustace would have to be in first, but then they couldn't have been there the year before...

The other thing about Peter, it could just be a set of 'end of year' exams, think Harry Potter, in which case we can't pinpoint his age at all...
 
Peter was working very hard for an exam and he was to spend the holidays being coached by old Professor Kirke

Yeah, or he failed last year's exams and he's trying to make them up now. Doesn't tell us much. ::sigh::
 
Another question is what did 16-year-old British boys do during WWII? If you do go by the "offocial" timeline, VotDT takes place in Aug 1942. Was he studying for military exams to get into a younger version of the military?

MrBob
 
Okay, next question: when does VDT take place? (Year-wise, I mean; Edmund tells Caspian it's been a year their time since they left, so we know it's about two years after LWW and PC is halfway between them.)

I've always assumed it takes place before the end of the war, probably around 1942. That means the Pevensies evacuate London at the normal time, that sort of thing.

Father had got a job lecturing in America for sixteen weeks that summer, and Mother was to go with him because she hadn't had a real holiday for ten years. Peter was working very hard for an exam and he was to spend the holidays being coached by old Professor Kirke in whose house these four children had had wonderful adventures long ago in the war years. If he had still been in that house he would have had them all to stay. But he had somehow become poor since the old days and was living in a small cottage with only one bedroom to spare. It would have cost too much money to take the other three all to America, and Susan had gone.[/I​


--But. the children shouldn't have been sent back to London until 1944 or 1945, right? This explains why they're hanging out at a tiny country station in PC instead of taking the train from London (or, if they had taken the train from London to the middle of nowhere, why they're apparently the only kids who did so)--they had to catch the train from the Professor's place. Even assuming he loses the house in 1941, they should be headed out to the country somewhere else for the summer of VDT. And for that matter, if they're spending holidays with him, shouldn't they know what happened to the house?
--A vacation in America? During the middle of WWII? A voyage across the Atlantic? It just wasn't safe, and it would have been hideously expensive due to rationing anyway. It seems sort of weird to take your wife and daughter on a vacation at that point.

Placing VDT in the summer of 1945 or 1946 would explain both those things. Then the Pevensies get out of school and head home instead of back to the Professor's house (or anyone else's), which explains why Ed and Lu have nowhere to go. And the end of the war would explain why it seems like the right time for a voyage to America and a proper vacation. It also explains why Peter isn't fighting or anything during the series; he's much too young.

OTOH it places LWW in 1943/4, which just...seems really late. Unless the Professor's was their second place? Or the parents just hung onto them for a while?
 
There is one explanation that needs to be examined. As I said before, historically, the evacuation only lasted less than a year (it is too late here for me to go find my sources again, I will do so tomorrow after I get off of work). If I remember correctly, most of the kids had moved back to their homes within 4 months of the evacuations. VotDT could have very easily taken place during 1942-3 from that stand point. The trip to America is less reconcilable with the time period. But Lewis definitely implies that the children experienced LWW during the Blitz.
 
I think the combination is a little weird--the holiday and the return. From what I remember (aaagh I had a book on this somewhere!), people started leaving in 1940 in large numbers, and there was another wave in 1944? London wasn't officially okayed for returning I *think* until later--1945? But people (I believe) returned anyway, because you'd want to--I think you're right that the evacuations peaked in the early 40s.
 
Animus, those are my arguments for altering the timeline. It is also stated that they stayed with the Professor "long ago in the war years." This, to me, implies that the war is over.

We do know one thing: story planning was not one of Lewis' strong points.

MrBob
 
Ok. Firstly: Going by Wikipedia again :)D), the kids would probably have been evacuated around 1939/40, and ought not to have returned until 1945. Though like Animus says - that may just be officialy. However, London did seem to be stricter than the other towns so I think we should say they didn't return till 1945.

If we say that LWW happened in early summer 1940, then PC would be late summer 1941. Now as Animus quoted, VDT must have happened after the war in the summer. By the way it says 'long ago in the war years' and that 'mother hadn't had a proper holiday for ten years' we can definitely say it's no later than 1948 (mum couldnt have gone on holiday during the war), but probably not much earlier otherwise 'long ago' wouldn't make sense. Now we actually dont know how long after PC VDT takes place. We only know it's more than a year - 'Last year, when he had been staying with the Pevensies, he had managed to hear them all talking of Narnia'. This also suggests that last year was post-war as the Pevensies were at home. I think 1946-8 is a suitable time frame for VDT.

SC happens in the autumn following so that would also be 1946-8 and in LB Eustace says they were last in Narnia 'more than a year ago by our time'. That puts LB at some point in 1948-50 - I would guess summer.

Now, I spoke to my gran about schools around the time. Bear in mind she went to school from 1925-1937 so it's a little before but here's what she said:

Infants: 4-7

Elementary school: 7-11/14

At 11 children would take an exam to get into grammar schools and if they passed they would go. Those who didnt stayed then left school at 14.

Grammar school: 11-16

My Gran says she took O levels. She said most people left at 16. Not many went further. She tried herself but left after a term or two.

Now she didn't know about boarding schools which to me suggests that those richer children would have gone through a different education system. I had a look online and it seems that children can start boarding at any age which unfortunately means we cant pinpoint Lucy...

I think one place we can start is with Peter. I looked more at the mention of Peter's exam and it struck me that it is just one exam! This to me makes me think it's a university entrance exam rather than school exams. Also if he's studying over the holidays - after school is finished - it would make more sense. And furthermore, he's gone to study with a Professor - it must be a high level exam for that so I say Peter is 18 in VDT, preparing for uni.

Now if Peter is 18 in VDT which is somewhere between 1946 and 48 then in LWW he would be between 10 and 12. 12 seems most likely as any younger would be too young. This means VDT and SC are in 1946 and LB is in 1948.

We know that Eustace and Jill are not at boarding school because it is mixed, yet I think Experiment House would be a Grammar School because Eustace seems rather intelligent. Considering both were at school the year before SC takes place then they must be at least 12 in SC. This would put their age around the events of LWW as being 6.

Therefore, the ages of Lucy, Edmund and Susan have to range between 7 and 11. Susan could certainly be 11, though I would put Edmund as 10 and Lucy as 8.

If we move to LB, we read that Peter is described as not quite 'full grown' but with a face like a king or warrior, and 'you could almost say the same of' Edmund. Lucy is described as a girl and Jill and Eustace as 'a boy and girl younger still'. We also know Edmund had an injury from a game of rugby. You'd think he'd still be at school if he was playing rugby so couldn't be older than 18. If we go by the above calcultions their ages in LB would be:

Peter: 20
(Susan: 19)
Edmund: 18
Lucy: 16
Jill/Eustace: 14

I think those ages fit those descriptions, although Lucy could perhaps be even a little bit younger maybe 15. Otherwise she's not really a girl.

Therefore, my final answer to the thread question is:

In LWW the Pevensie children are aged: Peter 12, Susan 11, Edmund 10, Lucy 7/8

Though in all honesty, Mr Bob is probably most accurate. I don't think Lewis really thought it through.
 
Wow, waterhogboy, that's an awesome response! :) I think I agree with you on a lot of it (and especially with MrBob--I don't think Lewis thought this through at all).

waterhogboy said:
Now we actually dont know how long after PC VDT takes place.
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Actually, I think we do know:
"Meanwhile," said Caspian, "we want to talk."

"By Jove, we do," said Edmund. "And first, about time. It's a year ago by our time since we left you just before your coronation. How long has it been in Narnia?"

"Exactly three years," said Caspian.

waterhogboy said:
We also know Edmund had an injury from a game of rugby. You'd think he'd still be at school if he was playing rugby so couldn't be older than 18.
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Eustace does say the others are out of school (I don't have LB on me but I can dig it up), although MrBob has an alternate explanation for that somewhere. Do you remember what thread we talked it over in, MrBob?
 
whb, thank you for that post. However, as Animus pointed out, VotDt takes place one year after PC, as Edmund tells Caspian at the start of ch. 2. My other issue was when you stated that Experiment House as not a boarding school. At the end of the book, it is stated that Eustace buried his Narnian clothes on the school grounds one night. The coed aspect of the school was probably one reason it was "experimental".

If we accept the official timeline, then the events of VotDT were in the year 1942. I don't believe that for a minute. How the Professor lost his house in the two years is unknown, though. In TLB, it is stated that the Professor's estate had burned down so maybe that is why he was living in a smaller home during VotDT.

"Eustace does say the others are out of school (I don't have LB on me but I can dig it up), although MrBob has an alternate explanation for that somewhere. Do you remember what thread we talked it over in, MrBob?"

No I don't know where hat discussion is, but I do remember my explanation. I speculated that the school year for Experiment House in TLB has a later schedule than Lucy's and Edmund's schools. We do know that it started in September as VotDT started on an autumn day with only two weeks having passed of their 13-week semester. If that is the case, and Lucy's and Edmund's schools starting in August, then it is possible that it could be the beginnijng of June in TLB with Lucy and Edmund both out of school for the summer and Eustace and Jull just on a weekend getaway with the Friends.

Another thing that makes sense for them to be in school (at least most of them) is at the very end of TLB, Aslan tells them, "The term is over; the holidays have begun." Why use that specific terminology if most of them had graduated?

MrBob
 
Yes - I missed the bit Edmund said. Well that's very strange then. For him to say it was just a year ago but a few pages earlier Lewis puts long ago in the war years!?!?

Oh well - I think that just bolsters Mr. Bob's point even more. I think I would be tempted to ignore Edmund's comment just because that skews things more than anything else. I will take him very figuratively when he says 'a year' and assume he means 'a long time' :D
 
I still don't think there is much cause to think that the alternate theory is correct. To quote the book,
"we're the only two who are still at school and we're at the same one...."
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For Eustace and Jill to be the only ones who were still at school for the spring term, they ought not have a week's holiday right at the end of their term. It is not just a weekend with the Friends of Narnia, they were with the Professor et al. nearly a week before the train crash.

"I say," said the girl. "It was you, wasn't it, who appeared to us that night when we were all at supper? Nearly a week ago."
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Inferring from Prince Caspian when Lucy starts school for the first time, I think you can guess that in LWW, their ages are:

Lucy is 10 (11 is the minimum age to start school)
Edmund is 11
Susan is 13 (I'm hazarding 2 years older than Edmund for Mrs Pevensie's sake)
Peter is 14 or 15.
 
I think it's important to remember that the air of Narnia made them more mature than they were on earth. Anyway, this is all pure speculation, isn't it? :D:D:D
 
One thing that you might want to factor in to your various calculations.
Most of you seem to be automatically assuming an eighteen year age for school leaving.
Back in 1940`s Britain the average age would be younger, more likely fourteen or fifteen unless they were going on to university or some sort of higher education, also since most higher education was fee paying its likely the Pevensies concentrated their available funds more on Edmund and Peter rather than the girls.
At the time Lewis was writing the books British schools went through a major revolution that created the modern state system.
For Eustace`s Experiment House, I suspect Lewis was `sending up` the Rudolf Steiner system of alternative schools which still exist today. Wikiing them makes for interesting reading if you ever wondered how Eustace`s school worked.
 
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Animus Wyrmis said:
I've always wondered if either of the boys (or the girls, I suppose) went on to university--I would think Ed, at least, would want to.
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Peter, at any rate probably did, I`ve often wondered if the exam refered to in VOTDT that he was being tutored for by the Professor was in fact his entry exam.
At age 20 he could have been a student but was probably preparing for his two year stint of national service that he is required to do when he hits 21. (So 20 is the oldest he can be in LB.)
Susan (at 18 or 19), the next in line probably didn`t since its hinted that she`s not academically inclined.
She may actually have some sort of job and be becoming more independant. If you think of it, that would explain a lot of other things.
Edmund (17 or 18?), he might have just started or was preparing to at the time of LB.
Lucy? (16 or 17?) I don`t know. We know she had probably just left school but was still a little young.
 
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