Wow.
I've just read through all the posts and feel like there are a million and one things I want to say in reply but I can't possibly get it all down - let alone remember everything I wanted to respond to.
I have to say that, for me, I disliked the first scene due to Peter's attitude. I watched the film the first time, then re-read the book (I hadn't read it in years) then watched the film a second time. In doing so, I hopefully won't say anything about the book that is wrong - but forgive me if I do! It also allowed me to kind of see the film as a film without the book and then to compare it to the book.
As I said to someone - the film, compared to other films, is great. But compared to the book, it isn't.
Anyway, my problem with Peter isn't just that he was a 'prig' or anything like that. I could see the worth in having him change throughout the film. My main problem was that he didn't seem to. In terms of seeing him actually different at the end - I didn't really see it. Yes, he changed, but I didn't think it was enough.
For example (and yes, I'm afraid I'll be comparing it to the book), in the book, Peter apologises to Aslan when he firsts sees Him. In the film, where he's acted worse than he did in the book, he doesn't.
I guess I'm saying that I could have coped with the changes a lot more if Peter seemed to change more at the end of the film, beyond giving Caspian his sword.
That said, Fifth Pevensie (I think it was your comment I'm referring to), I'd love to hear what you think about the scene between Lucy and Peter and why you think it was such a redemptive (is that even the right word?) scene?
I personally thought it could have been a great scene, but that they used words that were slightly wrong.
Lucy saying that we need to prove ourselves to Aslan, to me, was completely wrong. And it's the word 'prove' that I have problems with. Not the idea behind it.
(And yes, I am going to relate it to Christianity, one, because that's what Lewis intended, and two, because I'm a Christian).
The idea of proving ourselves, to me, sounds too much like works-based salvation - the idea that you can earn salvation by what you do.
However, what I think they have been trying to get at, and which is a concept I totally agree with, is the idea that sometimes we have to take a step of faith before God will reveal Himself, or His plan, or the next step, to us. Which is what, I think, Lewis, and even the film, were trying to get at. That until Lucy went after Aslan, nothing would happen (or, in the book, until the others followed Lucy, they wouldn't see Aslan).
But this isn't proving yourself to God, it's learning to trust more, to have faith and isn't done because to prove anything to God, but to change us into better people.
I guess, to me, the word 'prove' kind of negated one of my favourite scenes from LWW. When Peter's talking to Aslan and he's saying, I think you've got the wrong person, I can't do this, I'm not who you think I am, etc. and Aslan just turns around and says, 'Peter Pevensie (formerly) of Finchley' - He knows exactly who Peter is.
So Peter doesn't have to prove himself, but I do think Aslan wants him to grow and change and to take that step of faith.
(and I went on about that a lot longer than I intended...)
As to the second scene, there were parts that I really loved and parts I didn't like so much.
Watching it the first time (before reading the book again), I found that despite knowing it wasn't in the book, I could cope with the whole temptation thing. I thought it was actually a great portrayal of temptation.
I also really loved the way the ice smashed to show Aslan's image. I thought that was a great statement.
I thought that the werewolf was great - and the lines it speaks, yes, are basically word for word from the book (although I think it does skip a line or two), and I loved that part.
In terms of things I didn't like - as a Peter and Caspian fan, I much preferred how in the book Caspian isn't tempted like that and tries to stop things earlier, and the others rush in to help - but in terms of how the rest of the film was done, I thought it was a great scene.
And yes, I'm pretty sure it was Edmund who killed the werewolf.
Ok, I think I've covered everything I can remember for now - without going off on a tangent about what they did to Peter's character (which I probably have already done, so I apologise, I have tried to keep this focused on those two scenes).
In this thread, thoughts on his character is implicitly important to your enjoyment of the Stone Table scenes.
